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Duncan2316 · Mar 3, 2017 12:45 AM

Ive bred all of my best mares so far this year... every single one of them was a stallion and every single one of them was gelded...
Did the update just make this way harder i even had one mare bred to the same stud for the last 3 years all intact excellent foals.. but not thiis year. I am soo disapointed :( there goes everything i was waiting for all month long

Anyome else find this happening to them and why so many stallion foals?

Sorry for the rant im just so devistated and discouraged; all my hard work

StarfireAcres · Mar 3, 2017 1:05 AM

I'm nt sure if the tests are harder to pass I got a lot of superior to mom and dad fillys that passed testing so I'm not sure

Goobanni · Mar 3, 2017 1:07 AM

I don't think it's harder. I think it's just more of a shock when you do a whole heap of foals and more than half are gelded/spayed with the bulk testing, Where as before you on do one at a time and don't notice so much.

Ammit · Mar 3, 2017 3:03 AM

I looked over your barn. First I only see 8 foals. That is so few that even before testing updates you could expect 8 of 8 to not make it. There is a decent amount of random swing. I do see that 3 are intact though. So I am not sure if they passed or you just did not test them.

I also see a lot of SUPER uneven breeding. That is going to get you altered foals. Your foals can't be a lot worse than either sire OR dam to pass testing now. If you breed a red quality dam to an A quality stallion that is a big difference. Most foals are an average of their parents and the average of two very different horses is never going to be as good as the higher quality parent.

The best thing you can do to get more intact foals is to get out of these uneven ice/fancy color lines that are not helping you and work on breeding some good old foundations who have 30 days pasture bonus. That is going to get you the largest number of intact foals. It is absolutely focusing on color over solid breeding that is making so many altered foals for you.

best friend · Mar 3, 2017 3:08 AM

I think it is harder. Out of 5 foals my only one that made it is inconsistent. My best foal should of. I am thinking about turning testing off for a bit.

kassierae · Mar 3, 2017 3:10 AM

You guys have a super small amount of foals to gauge, and hand breeding is almost always a crapshoot regardless of parent quality.

best friend · Mar 3, 2017 3:22 AM

With just 2 pastures i cant put all ofmy different generations in? So i do my most in them which is foundies and 2g. I did inhand last season and didnt get this many altered. Then let me ask you this is it worth breedingnow with straws and eggs? Someof my straws I bought with a lot of money. I am scared to breed anything?
2 of my alters us out of exceptional perfect mare and a perfect foundation stud and my other one is perfect foundation to pwrfect foundation. Thwy were both my nexus foals. I would expect my except. Perfect mare to not have to be in pasture to make a quality foal. Going by others.

Ammit · Mar 3, 2017 3:30 AM

best friend if you breed a perfect foundation mare to perfect or normal foundation studs you don't have any issue. But like kassierae you simply can't expect to get a bunch of intact foals out of 5 breedings.

best friend · Mar 3, 2017 3:37 AM

@Ammit my nexus line is all perfect foundations and my one mare ezceptionally. That is why I am confused why they didnt pass. I think one was inconsistent so that doeant bother me about them being altered but my other one was consistent.

best friend · Mar 3, 2017 3:40 AM

http://hj2.huntandjump.com/horse.php?horseid=759248

Did he get alteres because of his PT score being less than his sire? So would this make him inferior to him?

Ammit · Mar 3, 2017 3:48 AM

PT score is never looked at in breeding advice. He was altered because his breeding ability is too low compared to his dam.

Ammit · Mar 3, 2017 3:49 AM

If you paper more of your horses (remember gelding and spayeds are free) You will be able to see what is going on better. C = Yellow papers. That cross is a C to Red paper (uneven) and his is only a C paper. He would need at least B papers to be good enough to pass.

C= Yellow
B=Red
A= blue
*Star = *Gold

best friend · Mar 3, 2017 3:54 AM

Aw ok that makes sense. What do I do with my exceptional sense she definitely wont be a good cross? Sense Northern is just perfect foundation?

Ammit · Mar 3, 2017 4:37 AM

Use her with second gens :D Or just keep using her on normal foundations and know it will be a bit harder to get an intact.

best friend · Mar 3, 2017 4:40 AM

Ok.

Wildland Acres · Mar 3, 2017 8:35 AM

Ammit. Does the new updates" there is a big difference between red mare and A stallion" mean that I am basically guaranteed to get all my goals snipped if I use the A papered 2g stud I was so excited about? (Only two of my mares of age for 2g are blue) he is even, don't worry. But Using him was a goal to be able to improve my lines. :(

Wildland Acres · Mar 3, 2017 9:00 AM

Now, I don't want to sound rude or anything, this is just honest feedback. If this is the case with this new testing system, I probably won't free test fillies from the A papered 2g, or one of my other stallions, run everyone through papering and then sort out ones with quality I want. My goal even before this was to switch to blue papered 3g mares, and this instant papering is working miracles! Thank you! I just don't want to spay a bunch of blue papered fillies from the A boy and be left with intact reds from my B papered 2g boys.

Ammit · Mar 3, 2017 11:59 AM

Wildland I don't think that logic follows at all. If the fillies are blue papered and about as good as an A papered they would not be spayed.

StarfireAcres · Mar 3, 2017 2:05 PM

Yes it's much harder I bred a gold papered mare and a star stallion together the same pair I used last season I and last season I got a lot of great foals from that pair that were all intact fillys and colts. i used 7 straws and all were gelded and spayed but one and he papered below dad! So yes it's much harder and not really fair

StarfireAcres · Mar 3, 2017 2:14 PM

How does it make sense that a gold papered even bred mare and a star papered even bred stud are not having any intact foals but a red papered mare and a b papered stud are having intact studs? That makes no sense

kintara · Mar 3, 2017 3:00 PM

Higher papers don't make intact foals easier, if anything it makes it harder because the range of quality in the Stars and Golds can be much greater. Keep at it, just know the intact foals are worth having!

kassierae · Mar 3, 2017 3:09 PM

Heck, before the update I was having trouble with my higher gen foals. Ammit has stated that it is NOT harder. Each breeding has parameters for horse quality outcome, sometimes it's just a roll of the dice and the foal got the short end of the stick. Just like in real life, you can breed two horses of excellent quality and still get a "dud". Look at Secretariat, he never sired a horse that raced as good as him, and he was bred to the best of the best.

StarfireAcres · Mar 3, 2017 3:24 PM

But 10 duds all at once not a single intact foal when before update all my mare would throw was intact high quality foals her PT is at 11.7 she threw a foal with 12.5 PT and star papered 5 foals were simular to that one.

kassierae · Mar 3, 2017 3:31 PM

That's only ten foals. And you're hand breeding, which will always have poorer results than pasture breeding. PT is not related to breeding, only showing and training ability.

Foxx · Mar 3, 2017 3:33 PM

@Ammit while you are handing out advice could I ask you to look through my barns?

Ammit · Mar 3, 2017 3:33 PM

No it is not harder. I know because I have the actual numbers and you don't. ;) Even if it was harder you still are getting the exact same dice range as before. Those foals are no worse than last year. You just did not know they where not that great.

"Even bred" doesn't mean anything. As I keep explaining you need even ability. The game has no idea what the pedigree looks like. If you link the horses in question I can take a look for you and see what I can find out. :) I am happy to help out but it's not like I am lying about the numbers.

StarfireAcres · Mar 3, 2017 4:01 PM

This is her. And I would put her in pasture but I don't have a good enough stud! No one will sell me the one I'm looking for

Galaxy Bliss 7g

StarfireAcres · Mar 3, 2017 4:04 PM

And there's this mare I want to breed to I have eggs from her and one egg from the mare above

Neptune Dreams 7g

Ritsika · Mar 3, 2017 4:11 PM

Oh! The light bulb just went on while I was reading this discussion and I am so excited about the new testing now. I will admit that I am super disappointed in the papering of a lot of my fillies thus far, but the ability to paper them so quickly is awesome, and this will significantly improve my herds quality in later months.

My real, ah-ha!, is that the fillies (and colts) now have to be about as good as their sires as well as their dams whereas before it was only their dams. Which was why my fillies are lagging in comparison to my colts. If my mediocre mares were slightly better than their mediocre dams, then the foals of the mediocre fillies would also be only marginally better instead of actually stepping up and quality like I expected them to. This is so exciting! I've never been too concerned about snipped colts because they had more instantaneous testing such that I could determine their quality as a foal. I have been horrid at culling my mares because I need to invest so much more time and hbs figuring out if it was even worth it - waiting until they are six to eight years old until culling. So excited to see what my pastures produce! :D

Wildland Acres · Mar 3, 2017 5:06 PM

... Ok, makes sence Ammit. Then this new papering system might help me out more. Will have to have to see what I can/Can't get to work with my strategy, but sounds like this will be fun... just need to make sure not to look at any of my goals before testing them. Can already feel the pain of some of those future snips! Lol

ConfluenceFarms · Mar 3, 2017 6:20 PM

Ammit · Mar 4, 2017 3:04 AM

@Ritsika EXACTLY! This change will completely end the problem of lagging mare lines and make progressing your lines a lot easier. People are just having a harder time of it on HJ2 because the lines are a lot more uneven over her. Especially the color breeders are having problems, but after a season or two it is going to be way easier to know the quality of your lines.

Ammit · Mar 4, 2017 3:07 AM

@StarfireAcres both those mares are really low golds. Look for a star stallion with a AFPT in the 11.8 to 12 AFPT to breed them too.

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